All About Symbian - Symbian, Nokia and S60 unwrapped.
No current plans for Samsung Symbian handsets
Published by Rafe Blandford at 16:58 UTC, September 2nd 2010
In a report from the IFA Consumer Electronics show, Reuters quotes Y H Lee, Samsung Mobile's head of marketing, as saying that the company is concentrating on "Android and Bada for its mobile devices". Samsung see that there is some "specialised demand" for Windows Mobile, but is "not seeing visible demand for Symbian". Reuters further reports that, although the company remains ready to introduce Symbian devices, it currently has has none planned.
The report would appear to rule out the possibility of a Symbian^3 handset from Samsung, but does leave open the possibility of a future Symbian handset (Symbian^4 and beyond). This is consistent with Samsung's previously stated position, but may leave its Symbian users (most notably owners of the Samsung i8910) disappointed.
In sales terms, Samsung has sold relatively few Symbian handsets (in the low millions), but it has been an important proof point for Symbian to claim the world's two biggest handset manufacturers among its supporters. Samsung continue to participate in the Symbian Foundation at all levels, although the minutes from the various council meetings do suggest that it has recently been less active than other handset members, such as Fujitsu.
Samsung has put little marketing support behind its Symbian products, even when it has a technically very capable handset, which has undoubtedly contributed to the low sales figures. Moreover, users of Samsung's Symbian devices have been plagued by poor support, most notably the (lack of) provision of firmware updates; as a result a significant home-brew firmware community has arisen.
The biggest issue facing Samsung's Symbian handsets has been the necessity to compete with Nokia's Symbian handset portfolio. It is no surprise that with Nokia fully committed to the platform, compared to Samsung's platform agnosticism, there were few reasons for operators or consumers to opt for a Samsung Symbian handset.
While the Symbian Foundation offers a theoretical level playing field in terms of governance and a say over the future direction of the platform, Nokia remains in de facto control, thanks to its dominance in code contribution and package ownership. This is an uncomfortable position for Samsung, given that Nokia is their biggest competitor in the mobile space. However, it is not possible to rule out the possibility of future Symbian devices from Samsung, but the likelihood is largely dependent on market and platform developments.
Going forward, I would anticipate that Samsung will commit fully to the Bada platform, but will maintain an interest in other platforms where there is market demand. Android, for Samsung, is important in the short term because Bada's lack of maturity means it is not yet a comprehensive mobile solutions platform. In the longer term, Samsung is likely to shift as much activity as possible to Bada.
In time, I would expect there to be three mass market 'open' mobile handset platforms: Android, Bada and Symbian. These will be joined by a number of 'boutique' platforms focusing on the higher end of the handset market: iOS, MeeGo, RIM OS, WebOS and Windows Phone 7. Clearly there will be some market cross-over between the two groups and many of these platforms will have, or already have, aspirations outside the handset device segment.
Rafe Blandford, AAS, 2 Sept 2010
News Discussion
Third party developers' resources and consumers' attention are limited.
I think over the next couple years there are going to be shake-outs, consolidation and outright elimination by acquisition.
I don't see Bada going anywhere, for example. Meego, maybe, but it'll depend as most things, on consumer uptake/interest. WebOS, who knows; depends how H-P handles it or does with it. It was great on a Palm Pre, but I have no desire for a WebOS printer.
We'll see, I guess.
Sony info via Unwired View
Looks like Symbian left with Nokia - that was a waste of 2 years and Euro 800mln odd.
No room for Windows Mobile 7 (or whatever it is this week) then?
Meego might change this. Two weeks to find it out.
I have Nokia N82 and waiting for Android 3 device or Meego IF it really comes out with an impressive device.
Furthermore, if you read the articles on AAS on Symbian vs. Android in the low end smartphone sector, we see clearly that Android simply can't compete due to fundamental architecture problems (i.e. basically unfixable). So Symbian will rule the entire low end for the forseeable future. And where is all the growth in smartphone sales - at the low end. And where is all the growth in mobile generally? The developing world (emerging markets). Which loves low end, and loves Nokia already (and where these places have smartphones already, they're all Symbian). So one can easily forsee a future where Symbian increases it's dominance to unimagined levels - gradually consuming the entire featurephone market bit by bit - and Android will always be trailing Symbian in this growth because Android can never run well on the cheaper hardware that Symbian can.
As for usability Symbian^3 is more than a match for Android, Symbian^4 will cement that further.
Finally, BADA is nowhere, and with few prospects. Yes some handsets will be launched, yes a few devs will offer a smidgen of support, but big sales? Sales to rival S40 or Symbian? Never going to happen, not even slightly close.
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Originally Posted by Unregistered
I must say the vast discrepancy between talk and reality is quite amusing really. ..... Never going to happen, not even slightly close.
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With their crappy support of their recent Symbian devices, I am crying dry tears on this announcement to be honest. From a consumer point of view, it is utterly irrelevant that Samsung is dropping Symbian, since Symbian has always been best on the Nokias and Sony Ericssons anyway.
As for BADA, well who knows what is going to happen, it can go both ways. No doubt Samsung will try everything they can to make BADA a success. Just like Nokia, Samsung doesn't want to be a Google OEM of they can help it.
Whether SE will stop supporting Symbian is in no way confirmed. Their Vivaz has been quite a sales success and it is in fact a decent device. But of course their X10 Android line has also been a success, so who knows. Nothing is confirmed nor sure, yet. The jury is still out.
Actually, the only caveat for SE regarding their non-Android handsets, is their sporadic support for their Playnow Arena app store for their feature-phones and Symbian phones. If SE doesn't step up on that front (and the assumption that "apps" is so important as tech media would like you to believe), they might very well seal their fate as a Google/Microsoft OEM in the future, and hence the rest of the discussion is irrelevant. Is that a valid way to go for Sony Ericsson? Well, maybe or maybe not.
So, if Nokia ends up being the only manufacturer using the only true open-source OS, Symbian (and Meego)...well, so what? It is the only Symbian manufacturer who puts the necessary support (Ovi Store and other services) in Symbian anyways, and has by far the largest scale.
I'd also agree that there is likely to be some consolidation too. Difficult to pick out any thing particularly. Most platforms now have a major backer with the money to keep trying / support it.
Just as Nokia puts people off Symbian so will Google put people off Android. Manufacturers will not want to become Google OEMs in the style of the PC market. Thus I expect to see a certain amount on multi-OS plays from other players (HTC, Sony Ericsson, LG, Motorola).
Sony Ericsson is a hard one to judge. It is enjoying significant success with Android, but I'm not sure how sustainable this (thinking competitive Android scene and the plenty of cost based competition). They have said they want to go to two OSs: Android + ?. I suspect internally there's probably a big debate going on right now, with different people on each side. Symbian is somewhat handicapped by its current form (Symbian^1), but looking to Symbian^4/5/6 it looks much more competitive. WP7 is a bit of an unknown and may not be a great match for Sony Ericsson global footprint, but does seem to have some promise, especially in the US market... need to think about this one some more.
Yes its hard to see how Bada will go. But based on Samsung's number 2 position in mobile and strength in other consumer electronics I think it should be taken seriously. Samsung is probably the only company (along with Nokia) which is big enough to be a platform on it own.
Of course such predictions, such as these, are not easy to get right - too many factors involved, and much depends on market conditions/ demands / forces - its interesting to speculate about though.
As for SE, with the vast amount of customisation they have made to Android, I can't see them dropping it anytime soon. WinPho 7 is a complete OS with basically everything included (Maps, Marketplace, Exchange support, Zune, XBox) so SE has to do little to it (although this might be a negative as well). Symbian requires too much work and/or money and this is something SE cannot afford at the moment.
They are definitely in a "Wait and see" mode, especially because so much is depending on Nokia for Symbian^4.
Looking at what is going on regarding the i8910 lately, I wrote a post:
Samsung i8910, an alternative to Nokia for Symbian^3? - http://jfourgeaud.wordpress.com/2010...-for-symbian3/
The poll has received quite much support with 974 votes, 950 in favor, at the time of this reply.
Some have even suggested that they are willing to pay to make that happen.
I've tried to contact Samsung representatives connected to the Symbian Foundation, but it has been quite difficult to engage with them.
It's a shame because it might not be such an investment to enable them to sell few more hundreds of thousand devices..
Heard a rumor the other day that Samsung was making an i8910+ that was running on Symbian^3, doubt so, but never know.
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Originally Posted by Unregistered
If Nokia are going to sell Symbian phones and retain clear winner apps like Nokia maps only on Nokia phones, then there is no reason for other makers to attempt to build phones to compete.
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Why would any manufacturer in their right mind even attempt to compete with a Symbian handset? It's crippled out of the gate. If you go symbian, you have to provide your own store, mapping service, backup service, mail delivery system, etc.
If you go Google or WP7, those services are provided. Is it any wonder that nobody is buying this 'openness' crap about Symbian? Sure, it's open... but you'll spend tons of money replicating what's available on every other platform.
If Nokia *really* wanted Symbian to take off, they'd open up Ovi to all Symbian handsets.
ExtaMax Male Enhancement
Is there REALY major growth in the low end??? Last i checked despite the high prices for the majority of Androids its grown rapidly, at this time last year Android was hardly being taken seriously, fast forward to 2010 Q3 and its Android devices ruling the high end. Has between Q3 2009 and Q3 2010 i bet Android has grown far quicker in terms of market share and sales volumes than Symbian. Its convenient for someone to compare Android growth in low end to Symbian when Symbian has been low end for years, Android only JUST came in to low end this year, i give it another year and Android will be hot on Symbians heels in the low end as well. X10mini and HTC Wildfire have proved to run well on low end hardware,and have been very successful, Android is maturing at a rapid rate just remember that.
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Originally Posted by Unregistered
Who cares that Samsung aren"t going to Release no more Symbian mobiles,as they tried Bada an realised it was not as good as they were Expecting,They should not be allowed to choose the Software they want an stick to Bada,they are now Using Android just to succede in the USA market more an got windows 7 coming out soon ,but if Nokia get the Symbian 3 or 4 really going an Meego as well,Nokia should not let Samsung come back an use Symbian again the same to Sony Ericsson,hope Nokia show the others up an shows them they made the wrong decision not using Symbian on future mobiles
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It seems that many AAS people mix up the advantages between Symbian and Nokia. Take the 'Budget Smartphone' series as example. Yes 'Nokia Symbian' is successful in this price range, but this point should be credited to Nokia only, not Symbian. Nokia could still be successful using S40, just that Nokia now chooses Symbian. Even if other manufacturers release a Symbian budget phone, without all kinds of Ovi things they are just a little bit better than feature phones.
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