All About Symbian - Nokia (S60) and Sony Ericsson (UIQ) smartphones unwrapped

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  #16  
Old 16-06-2009, 07:57 AM
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DJ does damage-limitation PR

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Originally Posted by morpheus2702 View Post
I amazes me that AAS will entertain what is frankly utterly self indulgent and without any measure of hard objectivity, complete pap
I agree with Morpheus, this is complete pap written by an airhead.


The N97 is a serious let-down: it's only impressive if you have very low expectations. The user experience is poor: starting with the keyboard, not enough RAM, and a clunky UI only fanboys like Justin are going to tolerate.


Palm and Apple and even Android have raised the game and Nokia/Symbian isn't keeping up.
For example, why can't Nokia make the settings UI as logical as a Blackberry or a Sony Ericsson?


On his blog Twitter Justin says "Symbian is going from strength to strength". OK, we can see Justin isn't the brightest spark in the world, but he should read the analyst's stats: smartphone share down YoY.

  #17  
Old 16-06-2009, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
I agree with Morpheus, this is complete pap written by an airhead.

The N97 is a serious let-down: it's only impressive if you have very low expectations. The user experience is poor: starting with the keyboard, not enough RAM, and a clunky UI only fanboys like Justin are going to tolerate.

On his blog Twitter Justin says "Symbian is going from strength to strength". OK, we can see Justin isn't the brightest spark in the world, but he should read the analyst's stats: smartphone share down YoY.
That's your opinion and Justin shared his. I don't think it's necessary to insult the author, just say you don't agree with the opinion.

And on the point of Symbian going from strength to strength - market share is one figure you can use, but there's a lot of other factors. I think Symbian is in a much stronger position than it was a year ago (from a strategy / position point of view due to the Symbian Foundation), and I think most analysts would concur with that. It does, of course, still face a lot of challenges.
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  #18  
Old 16-06-2009, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by jonnybruha View Post
That's just it. With the N97 not having an OMAP3 in an environment where all other flagship phones do, you're going to hear a lot more about what the N97 CAN'T do than what it can.
But if I don't need OMAP3 then there's no point worrying about it. And I don't need it, and many people don't need, or even know that they don't need it.

  #19  
Old 16-06-2009, 09:14 AM
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When you start telling your customers that they don't need something, you aren't in sync with them anymore, you've lost their pulse and gradually you're gonna lose those customers too.

Yes, I want Xenon on my phone (for video add an LED too)
Yes, I want the best in class processor on my phone
Yes, I want 3d hardware on my phone
Yes, I want the best in class optics on the phone
Yes, the sound quality should the be the best market can offer

If you wanna supply a spare battery in the box, I don't mind.

Give me a best in class product and I have no problems in giving you the best in class money.
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  #20  
Old 16-06-2009, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardeep1singh View Post
When you start telling your customers that they don't need something, you aren't in sync with them anymore, you've lost their pulse and gradually you're gonna lose those customers too.

Yes, I want Xenon on my phone (for video add an LED too)
Yes, I want the best in class processor on my phone
Yes, I want 3d hardware on my phone
Yes, I want the best in class optics on the phone
Yes, the sound quality should the be the best market can offer

If you wanna supply a spare battery in the box, I don't mind.

Give me a best in class product and I have no problems in giving you the best in class money.
Noble thoughts, but for something that I don't need (aka something that I keep getting told that I need when actually I don't) I'll keep my best in class money and spend it in the pub and on vacations.

  #21  
Old 16-06-2009, 11:05 AM
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Well, that may be your personal situation.

But, the fact is, that Nokia is selling this device as the best mobile powerhouse ever. And, It is simply FALSE.

It has nothing that puts it ahead of competition.
Clunky UI: this is something that even those who don't need anything from a phone, will notice)
Old hardware: most people spending 700 on a phone, DEMAND latest technology. N97 is, in this subject, a complete rip-off.
Processor: You may not need it, but having a DECENT processor into the mobile does make a difference. Personally I'm growing tired of waiting for my 5800 to respond to my commands (and I'm not the fastest operating it...)
3D: Same as above, If I spend such money I expect to play DECENT games on it, not a 10 F.P.S. nightmare. (I will let the whole n-gage fiasco subject for another post....)
Sound: well, again you may not need it, but I would like to have a medium-decent DSP onboard.
Xenon: Of course, I don't think the BOM would suffer too much. Plus, the N97 is a brick already so form factor was clearly not the issue...
Optics: Well I can bear to have the same optics than on 2 years old phones, but honestly It won't help to make my mind and spend that little fortune.

In the end, I think that these kind of devices are designed for people who CARE and NEED such features and they (we) DEMAND them.

Otherwise, If I don't need any of those things and I only need to make calls, why would I buy a new phone? I wouldn't even have a valid opinion since I am not sufficiently informed on what those features would add to my current experience... Obviously, if I don't need all those, It is because my current experience is NULL.

Final point: Nokia needs to rehab themselves, regain the hardware advantage and catchup wiith OS development. Meanwhile, I am fed up.

My two cents.

  #22  
Old 16-06-2009, 11:53 AM
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Easy choice, iphone, it just works, Nokia need to start again with the OS, end of message....

  #23  
Old 16-06-2009, 12:43 PM
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Rafe, first of all thank you for even responding.

I would be the last person to tell anybody how to run their site. But if I could just offer one bit of humble advice:

Please stop praising any new device that comes out of Finland just for the sake of cheerleading. Let's leave that stuff for the amateurish "blogs", shall we?

I have come to expect a lot more from AAS.

Thank you.

  #24  
Old 16-06-2009, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
I don't think it's necessary to insult the author
It's our intelligence that's being insulted here.

  #25  
Old 16-06-2009, 01:17 PM
Suju Krishnan
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I had the N97 in my hand for a while, when it released in India. I must admit that I was let down. The reason is not because N97 is not good, it just because my expectation was from a Flagship product.

One comparison of the N97 to the Nokia 5800 and you wonder, where is the extra money is going.

People don’t necessarily pay for “better components used” to make phone (when it’s a showcased as “The laptop to your pocket”), people pay for how much it has scaled from its predecessor.

I’m convinced that Nokia has got its strategy in place; it has to do some catching up in the high end space because Apple came in and spoilt everybody’s party (Thankfully).

As for AAS, they are indeed very good and they have a fan in me!!!

For the critics, I appreciate their views, but it’s fair to say you don’t come into a site about Symbian expecting an overdose of criticism on the N97.

  #26  
Old 16-06-2009, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suju Krishnan View Post
I had the N97 in my hand for a while, when it released in India. I must admit that I was let down. The reason is not because N97 is not good, it just because my expectation was from a Flagship product.

One comparison of the N97 to the Nokia 5800 and you wonder, where is the extra money is going.

People don’t necessarily pay for “better components used” to make phone (when it’s a showcased as “The laptop to your pocket”), people pay for how much it has scaled from its predecessor.

I’m convinced that Nokia has got its strategy in place; it has to do some catching up in the high end space because Apple came in and spoilt everybody’s party (Thankfully).

As for AAS, they are indeed very good and they have a fan in me!!!

For the critics, I appreciate their views, but it’s fair to say you don’t come into a site about Symbian expecting an overdose of criticism on the N97.
I agree with you when you say that people pay for how much it has scaled from its predecessor. It is a very good point.

Sadly, no Nokia flagship phone has scaled from their respective predecessors since the N95, even with its initial flaws.

N96 was a joke at best, a step back indeed if you consider features (the same as N95) and hardware (worse than N95)

N85, a letdown, a smaller-sized remake of the N95, with cooler buttons, nothing more.

The only true "innovation" at Nokia's camp in the last two years, is the 5800, and only because of touch (let's be realistic, Symbian 5th is NOT on the user-friendly, it has a very poor UI with bulky buttons and sluggish transitions).

And now, they try to convince us to shell 700 for a phone that is almost the same as the 5800, hardware-wise. Software-wise, It only adds widgets to the mix...

This is what I think: Nokia has had NO interest on improving their devices portfolio during the last 1 1/2 years, they have decided to focus on services and ignored the High-End. During this time, competitors have overtaken them and now, IMHO, all Nokia has to offer is a half-baked Ovi portal with no real device to enjoy it in all its glory (i.e.: the 5800 can barely handle Ovi.com pages without freezes or glitches, at least that has been my personal experience).

This trend is maybe more dangerous to Nokia's mid-term business than what they think, only time will tell. Me, I'm not going to shell any money on a device that adds nothing to what I already own.

It's not that we are critics Suju, It's that we have been highly dissapointed for a long time. We all expected a true flagship to regain the smartphone crown, but It seems that Nokia is not releasing anything new anytime soon.

  #27  
Old 16-06-2009, 02:17 PM
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People are moaning about the N97 not being the best at such and such comparing it to the iPhone, but I think gaming is the only thing that would be better on an iPhone over N97?

In fact they're completely different devices.

I think I would say the iPhone is for people that want to show off that they've got an "iPhone". Whereas the N97 is for people that actually like to use their phone as a multimedia computer. Of course they're not entirely distinct and there are overlaps, but thinking about "why would i buy an iPhone..." i can't think of any reason to get one as opposed to an N97.

- Perhaps someone would like to suggest some thoughts on this?


I don't really understand the fiercely negative feedback people get the S60 UI.
When I used an iPhone after having heard so much great stuff about it being 'so easy to use' I was very underwhelmed.


Also, people should lay off on the rude remarks and post their thoughts constructively.

  #28  
Old 16-06-2009, 02:29 PM
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Smile SmartBattery Life

Except for harddeep1singh (or ...) I miss in this dicussion the priority of batterylife . Do you want a Flagship with :
1. Need to carry around 12 batteries or more ?
2. Ending your Phonecall because of battery power lack ?
3. Not be able to remove your battery because of shortage or broken (like iPhone) ?
I think batterylife and specs should be in balance . See also the battery-discussion about Samsung i8910 .....

Regards jApi NL

  #29  
Old 16-06-2009, 02:53 PM
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Hi Dynite,

Agree with you, Iphone is not a device we visitors of AAS like or prefer over N97.

To me, Iphone is not comparable to any Nokia device, partly because of the reasons you mention. But I think that people here are not complaining "in comparison to", but complaining of the N97 not being the best at anything at all.

If any, we are thinking about "why should I buy an N97 and retire my N95/N85/5800...?" Don't you agree?

There are better imaging phones.
There are better gaming phones (again, N95 for example)
There are better texting phones (Eseries)

There are better phones at everything separately, but also overall. N97 innovates in nothing, and is a remake of the 5800, just a change in form factor and the inclusion of the N95 5mpix sensor.

I would expect a Flagship to be much more than that, and Nokia has offered nothing more than remakes for more than 1 1/2 years. Hence, we are maybe getting rude and angry, we don't like to be fooled.

Personally, I expect to see these comments read and understood at camp Nokia, but IMO they stopped hearing their customers feedback long ago.

As for the s60 UI, in my case it is a mix. I am deeply bored to see how many needed features are neglected because of unknown reasons, and also tired of the same look and feel we have grown with. I want something new, with more "bling-bling" into it. We all know and want the stability and multitasking, but It is expectable from a company that praises itself as the number one OS dev in the world that they release something that resembles the 21st century we live in.

I sincerely hope not to offend anyone, best regards.

  #30  
Old 16-06-2009, 04:06 PM
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@sunwong

I think you're right in that people should compare it to their current phone (mostly likely an N95 I would guess).

In that regard I think we've got some advancements here that its too easy to simply disregard.

vs N95 -

Nice large screen. I've just been showing a friend my N97 playing a iPlayer clip and he was like "wow that would be great for the train, the E71's screen is just a bit small for video I find". The hinge also helps here - don't have to hold it!

"Always connected" Instant access to your favourite websites such as facebook via widgets (I can see that being popular with teenagers/students in particular).

32GB built in with option of more via SD card.

Kinetic scrolling in the browser is a pleasure to use (my favourite feature of N97 actually) and just generally improved web access. Web pages actually load in a decent amount of time and don't do the 'load... show part of the page... reload with correct layout' routine any more. They load properly first time; much improved!

Build quality - N95s were a nasty plastic which creaked and was generally not particularily nice. The N97 feels much more solid.

Software Update - upgrade your applications on the device, simply!

+ all the new services which will tie in to N97 nicely..
Nokia Messaging
Mail for Exchange
Ovi Maps 3
Sports Tracker
Ovi Store
Files on Ovi


- Are lots of people going to spend £500 to get this sim-free from the Nokia shop? Unlikely.

But people are going to see what this device can do and when its time for them to renew their contracts or get a new contracts I can see the N97 being a very prominent choice.

+I guess there's gonna be a comes with music version soon which would be very compelling with that big eMMC storage.
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