All About Symbian - Nokia (S60) and Sony Ericsson (UIQ) smartphones unwrapped

  #16  
Old 23-02-2007, 03:33 PM
martinharnevie martinharnevie is offline
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Yes Steve, that's what I mean. Two boxes or one box? That's where the debate should be. Not the 'vs' this or 'vs' that.

I remain a two box person, since, amongst others, I still haven't found a good way to type on a phone which I'm holding to my ear....and because of that I guess I'm divergent, not convergent.

Because I have a second box which remains through the times - a much needed terra firma or continuum contrasting the FMCG nature of Symbian devices - I do not have to go through the repeated pains of moving my contacts, agenda etc from device to device.

And afterall, what are we talking about, a few hectograms....it's worth it.
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Last edited by martinharnevie; 23-02-2007 at 03:37 PM.

  #17  
Old 23-02-2007, 03:50 PM
krisse krisse is offline
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"However, I wonder how big a market is left for such a device."

It depends if you mean market share or actual sales.

Phones have spread round the globe in the time between the E90 and the original 9000 series Communicators, so I wouldn't be surprised if the actual sales and profits made from the E90 vastly exceed those of its predecessors simply because there are now several times more people buying phones and smartphones.

However, there's obviously a lot more diversity and competition now in the PDA/Smartphone field, and that will probably hit its market share.

But it's the actual sales, not the market share, that determine profits. It's better to have a reasonable share of a huge cake than a large share of a small cake.

  #18  
Old 23-02-2007, 06:45 PM
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have U seen that...

www clubimate com / ultimate / ult7150.htm

a real commie killer... now I started to have real doubts... Although I like the commies format better, the WM6 seems to appeal to me more than the S60 (unfortunately as I wish it was the other way round)

  #19  
Old 24-02-2007, 01:36 AM
skagen skagen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slitchfield View Post
Re: PIM sync. Basic PIM syncing is PERFECT in the Symbian OS world these days. In the last week all my PIM data has gone from E70 to N93 to E90 to N95, with no hitches whatsoever.

What you mean, of course, is that the subtleties of Outlook's data structure, such as task notes and categories, aren't synced over. And I fully support the idea that Nokia might improve their S60 apps to embrace these. Especially for the E90, the ultimate 'business' device.
These aren't "subtleties" they are the kind of tools that are bread and butter for power users. Who is the E90 intended for for if not business power users? Pray tell.

Also on some earlier comments, just my personal opinion but I dont find megapixels in current smartphones to be relevant at all. 3MP, 1.3, the are both pretty mediocre, mostly for the the use of the marketing dept and neither remotely coming close to threatening a digital camera. So whether WM has 1.3 or 3MP really is irrelevant to the size of the package.

  #20  
Old 24-02-2007, 02:37 AM
martinharnevie martinharnevie is offline
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Now, it's it a bit strange that on one hand E90 is mooted as the almost perfectly 'converged' device, but on the other hand, we're still relating to Outlook as a factor in PIM syncing?

So you are converged if you use E90 with Outlook (on another OS i might add), but diverged if you use E90 with a Psion 5mx?
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  #21  
Old 24-02-2007, 04:26 AM
skagen skagen is offline
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Sorry can you restate that question. I dont get understand.

And by the way another issue I would raise with MS Office compatibility is: where is the OneNote syncing?

On previous generations of phone this would not be a question at all but OneNote in Office 2007 is not a fantastic and highly useful piece of oganisational software.

If we claim that this is the ultimate business device, again, has anyone at Nokia actually thought about this? Or is it - like the Outlook categories and notes - something they glossed over.

Its all well and good to put out $1000 devices, but really there should be some coherent and clear thought behind the product from a user perspective, rather than trying to wow people with GPS. First make sure I can bring the key data I own on my PC before you are trying to sell me "enhanced services" - otherwise, the tail starts to wag the dog.

This sort of stuff is exactly why Nokia's Enterprise devices division is doing poorly and laying people off.

  #22  
Old 24-02-2007, 07:48 AM
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Cool

Where is 'Pensil' key on the front side of phone? How it is possible to select items and change language on full functional front side without 'Pensil' key?
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  #23  
Old 24-02-2007, 11:56 AM
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@skagen

on my WM5 device (HTC Universal) I cannot sync categories for Outlook Notes! Even M$ can't everything right. And WM5 can't even render HTML emails! If you don't like the E90 don't buy one. Also my 2MP P990 outshines the camera and video on my HTC Universal. And my K800i camera quality is in a different league to any HTC device I have used (Universal & TyTN).

Also please name ONE WM device that is a phone size package that has ALL the following: 3G/UMTS, HSDPA, GPS & 3MP camera (or even a 2MP camera).

Last edited by jah; 24-02-2007 at 12:03 PM.

  #24  
Old 24-02-2007, 12:42 PM
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Question VoIP

I have noticed in the pop-up menu of one of the screen shots that "internet call" is not presented as an option. Does this mean that the E90 is shipped with VoIP disabled? Cannot imagine.

  #25  
Old 24-02-2007, 01:26 PM
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The E90 does support VoIP / SIP.
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  #26  
Old 24-02-2007, 10:55 PM
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Thumbs up so is it any good

hi of you

love the technical chat but is it worth all the hype. do i ditch the 950 and go for it.

keep it simple for the lay menyhs

  #27  
Old 25-02-2007, 12:32 AM
skagen skagen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jah View Post
on my WM5 device (HTC Universal) I cannot sync categories for Outlook Notes! Even M$ can't everything right. And WM5 can't even render HTML emails!
I had a WM phone with Pocket Informant. It sure did sync all my contacts and calendar categories - and that was back in 2003. Is there any reason Nokia cannot at least hit that base level on a $1000+ "business phone" relased in late 2007? No, not really.

At this rate, Apple will come along, and within a coupe model revisions, render these guys a footnonte in history - while folks continue to make apologies for ineptitude.

I'll say it once again. The division responsible for this and other "E" series phones just laid of 300 people in Finland and double that number worldwide. Clearly I'm not the only one who thinks they are not doing a lot of things wrong!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jah View Post
If you don't like the E90 don't buy one. .
Aaahh yes, the intelligent response. One first seen in Neanderthals centuries ago and subsequent variants of which used to the point of tedium by their descendants since then.

Thanks for exposing yourself, but this forum is normally populated by intelligent insighful folks. Try to keep it to that level, please and I will do the same for you.

  #28  
Old 25-02-2007, 09:46 AM
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some replies

to skagen: I fully agree with you! The "subtleties" definitely are the kind of tools that are bread and butter for power users!

My frustration comes from the fact that in my 9210i, the synchronisation worked really PERFECT, including the outlook categories in tasks. So, one would normally expect than in 9500, more features would be added - e.g. notes synchro. What a huge disappointment for me was to discover that no new features were added and - if that was not enough - categories were no longer supported! So for almost two years I am struggling with moving new tasks to the proper category (task list) after each synchronisation.

And the story seems to be repeating now again. Instead of added PIM features, it looks like on e90 even less features will be available... I am not sure I am going to try to survive this "Nokia proposal" while so many devices with no such shortages are available...

And I again agree with you skagen that this is why Nokia's Enterprise devices division is doing poorly and laying people off...

to jah: check this out: www clubimate com / ultimate / ult7150.htm
In addition to all the features of e90 it has three-band 3G and a properly working PIM.

  #29  
Old 25-02-2007, 01:06 PM
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Skagen - you make valid point, but at the same time you might be able to appreciate that while the device does not do what you want it do, that for others it will fit their needs. Just as some will avoid Windows Mobile because of past bad experiences or because they prefer the S60 UI (and the same is true the other way round). I find the hardest thing in looking at these devices objectively is looking past your own opinion.

The PIM debate will run and run, but the truth seems to be that a vocal minority will get very worked up about it, while the majority of people who buy the phone will be fine. It is not a happy thing, but at the end of the day Nokia are more interested in a majority view than a minority.

As for your last comment - its a perfectly valid response - though maybe it could have been better put, but by questioning someone else intelligence you just make yourself look foolish.

BDS - I've seen the Ultimate devices and while the specs are good I would have serious reservations about build quality.
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  #30  
Old 25-02-2007, 01:49 PM
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PIM ctd

Rafe, thank you for your note regarding the Ultimate devices. Their poor build quality might be an argument in my internal debate, which device to choose...

And I would certainly prefer buying the new commie but it will very difficult for me if it prooves that the PIM's functionality (which I use virtually all the time) is limited even compared to that of 9500 (which was designed 3 years ago).

As regards whom Nokia listens to, I am concerned that - as far as their business devices - they are not listening at all and the poor performance of the business devices division is the best proof thereof.

I recall that two years ago when my firm was searching for a push e-mail solution, I presented my then new 9500 commie and tried to convince the IT decision makers to go for the 9500/9300 instead of the blackberry. They looked pretty interested until they figured out two things: the speed of the devices and, which was a key argument, poor PIM synchronisation - no notes, no categories in tasks... That was enough, blackberries were choosen and I am the only person who decided to go for 9500.

Hope Nokia will realise sooner than later (before they are forced to close the business devices division) that a PIM is one of the key applications for business power users... Not only on e90 but also on other e series devices...

regards
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