All About Symbian - Nokia (S60) and Sony Ericsson (UIQ) smartphones unwrapped

  #16  
Old 25-08-2009, 09:33 PM
sjdean sjdean is offline
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Originally Posted by buxz777 View Post
lets just agree to disagree
You mean you get to tell me what you think I need for my job and I got to lump it?

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Originally Posted by buxz777 View Post
you have an excuse for everything mate , lets face it many people have done your job without a sat nav for years havent they :-) sat navs have made driving lazy thats all it is ,
No people haven't done the same job for ages. As technology increases so people are expected to do more and more, cram more into every little bit of space that's possible. You seem to think that my driving is as easy as the easiest driving. What's happened to my planning ability, I'll tell you again because you seem to be totally ignorant in actually reading it, Im not allowed to plan. I don't have time to plan. I often get work given to my while Im onsite or while Im in my car where I don't have access to a computer for Google maps and pulling over every five minutes to look at a generalised map of the UK non-specific to the area is far too time consuming.

So, shut up, you don't know what I do in my work.

Last edited by sjdean; 25-08-2009 at 09:39 PM.

  #17  
Old 26-08-2009, 05:15 AM
ClockworkZombie ClockworkZombie is offline
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Help? Bah!

I think buxz777 has been more than helpful. It is unfortunate your phone is faulty.

I too repair computers and visit customers and as I tell my business customers, if there is something you cannot do without you should have a backup be it a computer or an accounting datafile.

If it is critical to your day to day existence then prepare for unexpected failure. What would you do if you accidentally dropped it down a toilet or spilled a glass of water on it or it was stolen?

The purchase of a cheap handset, or your previous handset, plus a spare sat nav device to sit in your vehicle would be a wise purchase.

Then as suggested earlier you can send it off with minimal inconvenience.

  #18  
Old 26-08-2009, 07:50 AM
sjdean sjdean is offline
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But we're not talking about dropping it down the toilet, we're talking about a phone with an inherent fault. Full stop.

It's inexcusable to expect people to have a backup because their hardware/software doesn't work.

Im surprised how many people are prepared to make allowance for substandard equipment.

Whether you can or cannot change it is irrelevent, it shouldn't happen and people should stop letting people walk over them.

It's that kind of behaviour that allows companies like Nokia to get away with it.

  #19  
Old 26-08-2009, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjdean View Post
But we're not talking about dropping it down the toilet, we're talking about a phone with an inherent fault. Full stop.

It's inexcusable to expect people to have a backup because their hardware/software doesn't work.

Im surprised how many people are prepared to make allowance for substandard equipment.

Whether you can or cannot change it is irrelevent, it shouldn't happen and people should stop letting people walk over them.

It's that kind of behaviour that allows companies like Nokia to get away with it.
I'm with you upto a point SJDean, but if you're car broke down what would you do with it? Not work? If you bought a car that stopped working 5 miles from the dealers, you'd replace it, or send it back for repair

This doesnt excuse Nokia for giving us duff hardware (mines the same as yours) but others have posted that there's work fine

Buy a cheap basic handset and GPS from eBay, or better yet borrow from a friend.

  #20  
Old 26-08-2009, 09:01 AM
ClockworkZombie ClockworkZombie is offline
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Help? Bah!

You seem to be very good at misunderstanding what people say.

I am saying to you, IF this device is so important for your daily routine then you should have backup equipment in case of accident, theft or a faulty unit that may need repair. I am not trying to make excuses for any faults your phone may have and I am sorry you are having problems.

It is not inexcusable to have backup hardware, I would call that prudence and your phone problem would then be only an inconvenience whilst it is being looked at, though irritating to be sure.

As I am in Australia the only help I can give you is advice, contingency planning is a necessary part of business.

I keep 3 copies of any document I deem important and one copy is off site in case something disastrous happens and I have a backup handset in case I have an accident with my current phone.

  #21  
Old 26-08-2009, 09:05 AM
celios celios is offline
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Originally Posted by sjdean View Post
Im surprised how many people are prepared to make allowance for substandard equipment.
This has I have to confess, surprised me also.

Quite a large proportion of forum posters seem to mouth off about a problem for a week or two and then strangely forget about it.

I think the fact that Nokia can rely on such people buying phone after phone with glaring problems is part of the reason why the N97 was in such bad shape at the launch.

My 2p.

  #22  
Old 26-08-2009, 09:16 AM
spirit44 spirit44 is offline
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maybe someone should set up a poll, would you ever buy another nokia again?

be interesting to see if the pathetic state of the n97 has REALLY put people off

i would NEVER EVER buy another nokia at launch, i will wait until all the problems are obvious and then nokia have released enough updates to sort them. otherwise you're at the mercy of nokias handset lottery, will i get one that works or not.....

  #23  
Old 26-08-2009, 09:19 AM
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I'm not shutting up anytime soon...

sorry
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  #24  
Old 26-08-2009, 09:40 AM
celios celios is offline
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Originally Posted by spirit44 View Post
maybe someone should set up a poll, would you ever buy another nokia again?

be interesting to see if the pathetic state of the n97 has REALLY put people off

i would NEVER EVER buy another nokia at launch, i will wait until all the problems are obvious and then nokia have released enough updates to sort them. otherwise you're at the mercy of nokias handset lottery, will i get one that works or not.....
I was playing with a friend's 3GS yesterday, and I was sorely tempted to stop off at the O2 shop on my home. If the September firmware doesn't deliver, I'm off to another manufacturer & platform.
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  #25  
Old 26-08-2009, 11:39 AM
sjdean sjdean is offline
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I'm with you upto a point SJDean, but if you're car broke down what would you do with it? Not work? If you bought a car that stopped working 5 miles from the dealers, you'd replace it, or send it back for repair
Actually there's many people who if their car failed to work, they wouldn't be able to work.

But if there was a fault with a car, they put on a factory recall notice and you take it to the dealers, possibly even get a (free) loan car depending on the circumstances and it would be repaired in a day.

The problem isn't that the phone is faulty, but that we agree to allow them to have it for two weeks and find it acceptable. They should have a fix and fix it at an agreed time and date of mutual agreement at a chosen Nokia Service Centre and get it back if not the same day, the following day. If they can't do that, they should as a matter of basic customer service provide a loan phone for the duration or a replacement.

If the doors fell off, my car, I'd want a new car!

I shouldn't have to buy extra equipment. I can't afford to buy extra equipment. A duff phone isn't the same as a phone dropped down the toilet.

One is bad manufacturing and shouldn't be tolerated, the other is an accident where I have to live with the consequences. These consequences aren't of my making and is just down to ^$&-poor customer service.

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Originally Posted by ClockworkZombie View Post
You seem to be very good at misunderstanding what people say.

I am saying to you, IF this device is so important for your daily routine then you should have backup equipment in case of accident, theft
In case of problems caused by myself, I will either replace out of my own pocket or make a claim on my insurance. It's my mistake. My responsibility. That's why I take care of my phone.

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Originally Posted by ClockworkZombie View Post
or a faulty unit that may need repair.
For issues caused by the manufacturer, I expect the manufacturer to be wholly and 100% responsible and if they can't repair it in a suitable time to provide me with a replacement. The law is an ass but as consumers we allow people to fob us off and say its acceptable. There is no customer service anymore, and its your fault. I don't expect to pay extra for stuffups by manufacturers.

I could understand it if it was outside of the warranty period, but it isn't. It's a new phone.

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Originally Posted by ClockworkZombie View Post
It is not inexcusable to have backup hardware, I would call that prudence
I would call that overspending. There is absolutely no reason why the phone should not work as advertised and if it doesn't, that surely must be a breach of the trades descriptions act, whether caused by misselling, faulty design, or incorrectly assembled at the factory.

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Originally Posted by celios View Post
I was playing with a friend's 3GS yesterday, and I was sorely tempted to stop off at the O2 shop on my home. If the September firmware doesn't deliver, I'm off to another manufacturer & platform.
September firmware? This is the one that cripples Nokia Maps?

Last edited by sjdean; 26-08-2009 at 11:41 AM.

  #26  
Old 26-08-2009, 11:48 AM
celios celios is offline
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September firmware? This is the one that cripples Nokia Maps?
No, that's the August firmware. The September firmware makes some things better apparently

  #27  
Old 26-08-2009, 11:55 AM
sjdean sjdean is offline
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No, that's the August firmware. The September firmware makes some things better apparently
And that's one of the inherent problems of phones vs cars.

Cars by and large mechanical.

Phones... could be fixed by firmware. Who knows. How long do you give to be fixed?

  #28  
Old 26-08-2009, 12:06 PM
celios celios is offline
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And that's one of the inherent problems of phones vs cars.

Cars by and large mechanical.

Phones... could be fixed by firmware. Who knows. How long do you give to be fixed?
I feel your pain... the N97 does have some hardware problems like the GPS and lens cover.

I'm giving them until 30th September, if I don't feel the N97 is a class leading device by then, I'm selling it and eating my losses. I can't be bothered to wait forever.

  #29  
Old 26-08-2009, 01:06 PM
ClockworkZombie ClockworkZombie is offline
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Help? Bah!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjdean View Post
Actually there's many people who if their car failed to work, they wouldn't be able to work.

But if there was a fault with a car, they put on a factory recall notice and you take it to the dealers, possibly even get a (free) loan car depending on the circumstances and it would be repaired in a day.

The problem isn't that the phone is faulty, but that we agree to allow them to have it for two weeks and find it acceptable. They should have a fix and fix it at an agreed time and date of mutual agreement at a chosen Nokia Service Centre and get it back if not the same day, the following day. If they can't do that, they should as a matter of basic customer service provide a loan phone for the duration or a replacement.

If the doors fell off, my car, I'd want a new car!

I shouldn't have to buy extra equipment. I can't afford to buy extra equipment. A duff phone isn't the same as a phone dropped down the toilet.

One is bad manufacturing and shouldn't be tolerated, the other is an accident where I have to live with the consequences. These consequences aren't of my making and is just down to ^$&-poor customer service.



In case of problems caused by myself, I will either replace out of my own pocket or make a claim on my insurance. It's my mistake. My responsibility. That's why I take care of my phone.



For issues caused by the manufacturer, I expect the manufacturer to be wholly and 100% responsible and if they can't repair it in a suitable time to provide me with a replacement. The law is an ass but as consumers we allow people to fob us off and say its acceptable. There is no customer service anymore, and its your fault. I don't expect to pay extra for stuffups by manufacturers.

I could understand it if it was outside of the warranty period, but it isn't. It's a new phone.



I would call that overspending. There is absolutely no reason why the phone should not work as advertised and if it doesn't, that surely must be a breach of the trades descriptions act, whether caused by misselling, faulty design, or incorrectly assembled at the factory.



September firmware? This is the one that cripples Nokia Maps?

Sometimes life hands you a turd sandwich and you have to eat it.

Whether you have broken or lost your phone yourself or if the problem is out of your control is irrelevant in the short term as you need a working solution immediately, or at least this is what you are telling us.

Once you are working ok then you start resolving the problem, you will be more in control when you do so as you will not be under as much pressure and if you are in control then the people at the other end of your calls have less power over you.

Backup equipment and or contingency plans are a necessity for any professional, if they want to be taken seriously.

You are carrying on like a 2 year old throwing a tantrum, not an adult.

A phone is a tool like a screwdriver. You have a replacement if it breaks and get on with the job. To address one of your other points, no one likes buying equipment or stock to keep on a shelf in case it is needed. This is a price of doing business.

One of my customers had 6 backups of all his work. one day his work computer and external drive were replaced, when he asked where his old drives were so he could get his data he was told they were gone. 2 backups down, he went home to find a power surge had killed his home computer and its external drive. 4 backups down, his laptop was working but the external drive for it had also died. 5 backups down. Now he keeps seven backups of everything.

This is the most unusual case of data loss I have had to deal with my point is the customer took responsibility for his data, has his contingency plans and kept on working after a couple of immediate backups to new drives. As he had lost no data he was in total control as he sorted out his options.

You can choose to be in control or you can be Henny-Penny complaining about the sky falling.

  #30  
Old 26-08-2009, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by ClockworkZombie View Post
One of my customers had 6 backups of all his work. one day his work computer and external drive were replaced, when he asked where his old drives were so he could get his data he was told they were gone. 2 backups down, he went home to find a power surge had killed his home computer and its external drive. 4 backups down, his laptop was working but the external drive for it had also died. 5 backups down. Now he keeps seven backups of everything.
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