All About Symbian - Nokia (S60) and Sony Ericsson (UIQ) smartphones unwrapped

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  #46  
Old 23-07-2008, 11:34 AM
bertolt bertolt is offline
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Steve,
Isn't the Samsung Omnia worth including in this comparison?

  #47  
Old 23-07-2008, 11:49 AM
davidmaxwaterma davidmaxwaterma is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassey View Post
One, as you mention, the N95 8GB has been out a while and had several firmware updates since it's release. The other two are brand new. Lets not forget the original N95 was almost unusable for certain things. It took a good couple of updates for it to become as good as it is
I don't get this point. Is it relevant what the device was like when it first came out? Surely what is relevant is what it's like *now*.

Perhaps you could expand on the point you were trying to make.

Thanks.

Max.
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  #48  
Old 23-07-2008, 12:18 PM
Menneisyys Menneisyys is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bertolt View Post
Steve,
Isn't the Samsung Omnia worth including in this comparison?
It might be but I seriously doubt it'd change the outcome much. (Besides, it doesn't have a built-in YouTube Player, unlike th Diamond.) Prolly only with the somewhat bigger on-screen keyboard (because of the slightly larger screen of the Omnia) that there would be a bit more favorable scores.

And, of course, the camera, which is on par with that of the N95 - unlike that of the Diamond.

  #49  
Old 23-07-2008, 12:20 PM
Menneisyys Menneisyys is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidmaxwaterma View Post
I don't get this point. Is it relevant what the device was like when it first came out? Surely what is relevant is what it's like *now*.

Perhaps you could expand on the point you were trying to make.

Thanks.

Max.
The issues Steve listed can't really be fixed with minor bugfixes, only with major OS revision upgrades (for example, with the scmallscreen & touch-friendly Windows Mobile 7 to be released early next year).

However, it isn't even known if any new OS versions are released for the Diamond / iPhone.

  #50  
Old 23-07-2008, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slitchfield View Post
>>I cant believe you put the N95 above the iPod touch/iPhone for music transfer. c'mon itunes/iTMS is 1000xmore seemless than WMP/nokia music store/pc suite.

Nope, I disagree. Windows Media Player integration with modern S60 handsets is superb and seamless. And faster than iTunes. iTunes only starts winning once you factor in people wanting to BUY DRM-ed music online.

Steve
I use OS X with nokia n95 - the integration is beta at best. In fact for music/video upload i just take out the memory card and copy it across manually. (just as well i dont have an 8gb) its just easier.
and of course n95 and cover art is a random beast at best.

at least the experience of iPhone is equal for windows / mac users. and they dont have to use WMP - which is bloody terrible - i know i used it for some time.

the music and video usage on the iPhone blows the n95 out of the water.

its not like i don't generally agree over all - i'm just being picky

i've gone back to n95 after a year of hacked iPhone useage.
because my main no1 use is the camera. and iPhone fails big time in that dept.
i found myself carrying two phones all the time so i would have a decent camera.

i would say the results stand in order - but theres alot of people that wouldn't give a fig as the iPhone is the only phone for them.

  #51  
Old 23-07-2008, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdushe View Post
You can turn off Touchflow 3D on the HTC, it is just a homescreen plugin.
can and should - though to be fair, its being sold on the back of touchflo 3D

i had a diamond for 2 days, before it went on ebay - its terrible.

though in the winter it will be useful for warming your hands/house/small south american country.

boy it ran hot.

  #52  
Old 23-07-2008, 02:20 PM
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I think the following are real issues with the iPhone for me:

1. No A2DP
2. No HID BT profiles
3. No Profile app
4. No file system
5. No Exchange Sync for To Dos & Notes
6. No inherent ability to edit Office documents (like many E90 users, Office doc editting is actually very useful)

And finally, the iPhone is very difficult to use one-handed.

The point is the iPhone is a media content playing & viewing device, it is not a device for creating content, unlike many WM & Symbian Smartphones. So I see a lot of people carrying 2 devices, a good Nokia/SE Smatphone and an iPhone!

  #53  
Old 23-07-2008, 02:53 PM
Bassey Bassey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidmaxwaterma View Post
I don't get this point. Is it relevant what the device was like when it first came out? Surely what is relevant is what it's like *now*.

Perhaps you could expand on the point you were trying to make.
Hi Max. Fair point. No, it doesn't matter to someone in the market for an N95 now if the N95 used to suffer from problems that have since been fixed. However, someone in the marker for a smartphone should be aware that;

a) early firmwares are usually not great (and that goes for most manufacturers)
b) some manufacturers have a better record than others of releasing fixes in a timely manner.

Also, Steve said he went to great lengths to make the comparison as fair as possible. Whilst I'm sure this is true, it wouldn't come as a great surprise to many that a device that has been out for quite some time and is based on a very mature operating system is quicker and more stable than two devices released 10 days ago and based brand new or only recently updated OS's.

I'm not saying it wasn't a fair test, I'm just pointing out that the products aren't exactly at the same stages of their development life-cycle (something I believe Steve has written about before) and that this may be worth keeping in mind. The N95 is at it's peak and about to be replaced. The iPhone and Diamond are in their infancy and "could" improve in the short-medium term.

You may regard either of those positions as an advantage/disadvantage, dependant on your point of view
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You look like you want to go away, But I know you’re gonna stay. For although your heart is in L.A, Your head is in my fridge. There’s flowers in your hair, they're not real their made of silk. There’s a note in your mouth, to remind me to get milk.

Wot Italian? from Boothby Graffoe

  #54  
Old 23-07-2008, 03:24 PM
slitchfield slitchfield is offline
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Good points - I'll be sure to schedule another test in 6 months time! Probably iPhone 3G vs Nokia N96 vs HTC Touch Diamond Pro (or whatever it's called), of which the N96 will be the least mature 8-)
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  #55  
Old 23-07-2008, 03:46 PM
Bassey Bassey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slitchfield View Post
Good points - I'll be sure to schedule another test in 6 months time! Probably iPhone 3G vs Nokia N96 vs HTC Touch Diamond Pro (or whatever it's called), of which the N96 will be the least mature 8-)
Not if the Raphael/Diamond Pro (or whatever) keeps being delayed it won't! Still some serious issues with that keyboard from what I hear. And, in any case, have you SEEN the size of that thing? I've seen slimmer desktop PC's! :0
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You look like you want to go away, But I know you’re gonna stay. For although your heart is in L.A, Your head is in my fridge. There’s flowers in your hair, they're not real their made of silk. There’s a note in your mouth, to remind me to get milk.

Wot Italian? from Boothby Graffoe

  #56  
Old 23-07-2008, 03:59 PM
neilhoskins neilhoskins is offline
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Excellent, balanced, and objective, if I may say so, Steve. To extend, I'd like to take the tests in different directions; as you've pointed-out yourself, there is no one 'perfect' phone because everybody has different requirements. My own suggestions for taking the tests in different directions:

- Receive an MS Word doc in email, proof read it, make some corrections, add, "The quick, brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" at the bottom, and email it back. (QWERTY-less handsets are allowed to use bluetooth keyboards, but the time taken to set them up must be added to the results.)

- Make a recurring calendar entry, using only the out-of-the-box calendar, for an event that occurs on the fourth Tuesday of every month.

- Repeat all tests one-handed.

- Walk down any UK high street with the handset in your jeans pocket without getting any funny looks.

- Find an application for a particular obscure task of your choosing, download it, install it, pay for it.

- Return from a day out, walk into the living room, and show the rest of the family all the photos and video you've taken on either the TV or computer monitor, using whatever is quickest and easiest (bluetooth, cable, streaming, etc)

  #57  
Old 23-07-2008, 04:27 PM
slitchfield slitchfield is offline
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ROFL. I think I can see where you're going with that task list!!!!!!!!!!!
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  #58  
Old 23-07-2008, 05:24 PM
leoni1980 leoni1980 is offline
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steve,

it's very easy to run through a comparison test as the owner and day to day user of one of those handsets and perform tasks easily which on the other devices you struggle with. this is familiarity. luckily I am the owner of both an n95 and a touch diamond and am easily able to compare some of the tasks you underwent.

basing the capability of a browser on how quickly it allows you to fetch a train time doesn't really strike me as a thorough test. the fact is that despite their lack of flash lite both the Iphone and touch diamond browsers allow access to the internet in a much more fulfilling way than the n95 does. for quick access to information over the net I'd probably go with my n95. I think for many people the difference in quality between the full web on the diamond/iphone and the n95 is as crucial as a good camera.


with regard to email, I use googlemail and have no problems with either my n95 or my diamond. both phones offer thumbpad t9 options although the diamond has the nice option of a qwerty thumbpad for more drawn out text input. I've never had to use the stylus on the diamond to reply to a text or email and am perfectly capable of submitting posts such as this one using the diamond on screen keyboard - hell I even have an enter key so I can do paragraphs, something impossible to achieve on the n95.


the diamond is not perfect, but it's very usable as a phone, has a superb bropwser and fits very snugly in the pocket. a2dp is flawless and email (for me at least) has never been a problem.

I love all these devices, but I do love my diamond the most at the minute...maybe you have a different one to me steve!

Last edited by leoni1980; 23-07-2008 at 05:51 PM.

  #59  
Old 23-07-2008, 08:16 PM
sjhong sjhong is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdushe View Post
You can turn off Touchflow 3D on the HTC, it is just a homescreen plugin.
Then instead of being called Touch Diamond it should be called "Tap with the Stylus" Diamond.

Quote:
Originally Posted by macwhu View Post
- the video test was unfair and skews the results. it's like adding in touch screen sensitivity as a test.
No, it's not. While shooting a video is a regularly used feature in phones, the touch screen in the Touch Diamond and the iPhone are ways to enter data in the device, the same as the keypad on the N95.
Adding touch screen sensitivity is a ridiculous suggestion even as an example. And, as we're talking nonsense, I could also add the following tests:
- Quality of the physical keypad (N95: 20 / iPhone: 0 / Touch: 0).
- Quality of the stylus (N95: 0 / iPhone: 0 / Touch: 20).

  #60  
Old 24-07-2008, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lynchem View Post
I generally use my phone for... er.... making phone calls ! I had a shoot out with my iPhone wielding friend and gunned him down easy with my N82.

Another category you should have included is "Fitting the phone in your pocket alongside your wallet".
n82 is an uber fatso brick compared to the iphone. 17.3mm vs 12.3
thats a third thicker!! in other dimensions they are similar
except the iphone is wider by 12mm

n82 camera is SWEEEEEET though. its 'rice' keys ruin it for me.

* Weight: 114 g
* Length: 112 mm
* Width: 50.2 mm
* Thickness (max): 17.3 mm

Size and weight1

Height: 4.5 inches (115.5 mm)
Width: 2.4 inches (62.1 mm)
Depth: 0.48 inch (12.3 mm)
Weight: 4.7 ounces (133 grams)
 

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