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  #16  
Old 23-07-2010, 12:50 PM
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morpheus2702 morpheus2702 is offline
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Don't think I said Android was great, just that it is on the rise.

And you kind of answer your own question: 'using an Android phone whilst I wait for Nokia to get its act together and release a decent handset with ^4'.

Android, great or not, is better than whatever Nokia has out there right now? And that's what Nokia/Symbian needs to deliver ASAP - a consumer handset with 2010 specs and expectations, in the hands of consumers.

Not any 'Reference' handsets.

  #17  
Old 23-07-2010, 01:21 PM
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Question my dream nokia

my dream nokia phone would be the size of E61i , the look of E71, and the power of N8.all compined toghether would be an overkill..

  #18  
Old 23-07-2010, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morpheus2702 View Post

Android, great or not, is better than whatever Nokia has out there right now? .
That's what I wrote clearly already in the post you replied to. I actually used the word "better".

I just don't think it would take very much to improve on the Android offerings.
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  #19  
Old 23-07-2010, 03:24 PM
talhamid talhamid is offline
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@Hardeep: I would love to find out what Android phone you have and what bugs or irritates you about it. I am not saying it is without fault, but compared to Symbian......

@Everyone else: Well, I think Android is not only 'getting better', but at this very moment is light years ahead of Symbian right now. It is fast, non-pretentious, unobstrusive, and does everything you expect it to do. Not to mention it is flexible, 1000 times so than 'open source' Symbian. I will again cite the earlier example of alternative homescreens/desktops vs Nokia's hyper-pathetic s60 v5 homescreen.

Another example: see how SBP Mobile Shell operates on a Symbian set, vs other sets.

Nokia's last hope is Maemo/Meego, and the sooner they put it on more devices, the sooner they will regain lost customers like me.

  #20  
Old 23-07-2010, 03:35 PM
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I've never heard of Symbian, by implication, being 'pretentious'

  #21  
Old 23-07-2010, 04:55 PM
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Wild ducks

Putting the fanboisisms to one side, doesn't the wild ducks project address this, at least partly?

  #22  
Old 23-07-2010, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by talhamid View Post

@Everyone else: Well, I think Android is not only 'getting better', but at this very moment is light years ahead of Symbian right now. It is fast, non-pretentious, unobstrusive, and does everything you expect it to do. Not to mention it is flexible, 1000 times so than 'open source' Symbian. I will again cite the earlier example of alternative homescreens/desktops vs Nokia's hyper-pathetic s60 v5 homescreen.

Nokia's last hope is Maemo/Meego, and the sooner they put it on more devices, the sooner they will regain lost customers like me.
Meego won't help if the UI is crap. How about S60V5 on Meego? On the other hand Symbian with a decent UI? What's the difference? There are not enough people who are geeky and nurdy enough to keep Nokia going because of the name of the OS on the phone. Symbian is what the normal humans will buy.

As for Android being light years ahead. Only in your dreams. I use both and Android is a bit disappointing. It's better than the existing S60V5 over Symbian (^1) but not by much. I guess that's why phone makers feel the need to enhance the UI.

  #23  
Old 23-07-2010, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by talhamid View Post
@Hardeep: I would love to find out what Android phone you have and what bugs or irritates you about it. I am not saying it is without fault, but compared to Symbian......

@Everyone else: Well, I think Android is not only 'getting better', but at this very moment is light years ahead of Symbian right now. It is fast, non-pretentious, unobstrusive, and does everything you expect it to do. Not to mention it is flexible, 1000 times so than 'open source' Symbian. I will again cite the earlier example of alternative homescreens/desktops vs Nokia's hyper-pathetic s60 v5 homescreen.

Another example: see how SBP Mobile Shell operates on a Symbian set, vs other sets.

Nokia's last hope is Maemo/Meego, and the sooner they put it on more devices, the sooner they will regain lost customers like me.
I used a Motorola Milestone for quite a while. Try:

- Excessive slowdown when playing Tower Defence and listening to tunes on Spotify. And when I say excessive I mean, the game is unplayable and the music is unlistenable.

- 'Reseting' of the contacts fields when switching between portrait and landscape mode. By this I mean the cursor is put back to the first field, from the one you were in.

- Flash gets out of sync if, for example - streaming music while taking a photo.

- Sticky keyboard in the web browser.

- Resets, hangs - you know, the usual.

Android isn't immune to bugs any more than Symbian. 'Buginess' needs to be seen as a per device problem, rather than an inherent property of a platform, such is the nature of embedded software.

As for openness. One - you completely misunderstand the meaning of 'open source'. How open source a software project is is precisely nothing to do with things like codecs supported, the ability to put whatever software you want on a device (that's the openess of the device, not the openess of the software). Two - if Android by your definition is so open, why can't a use OBEX push to send a vCard to another phone? Even dumbphones support this.

Symbian isn't perfect, neither is Android.

  #24  
Old 23-07-2010, 09:01 PM
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I would love it if they had 2 reference devices. There are companies, like Aava Mobile, that do just that. There reference device for Intel Moorestown can install Android or MeeGo OS and why not Symbian. With the plain, vanilla OS installed on a reference device purists can pay more and get an unlocked device that they can use for developing apps for different systems.

Hardware will always be more limited than software. A well-designed "reference device" that can load Symbian, MeeGo, Andriod, WebOS, Blackberry OS, Windows Phone 7 is probably possible as long as a device manufacturer had agreements to license the OS.

  #25  
Old 23-07-2010, 09:08 PM
Jimmy1 Jimmy1 is offline
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I would love a post from Rafe or Steve or Ewan on how Symbian 3 and the N8 functions day to day as a communications device, along with PIM functions.

Specifically, Facebook and Twitter intergration into contacts.

Nokia Messaging: did it get any better?

Are we finally going to get a native Foursquare app or maybe bundle it into Ovi Maps?

How about notifications in Symbian 3?

Destinations? Am I going to still keep on getting annoying pop ups in every single seperate application on how want to connect to the internet, 3G or Wifi, or which connection (I expect to need to do this ONCE when I first set up the phone and that's it. All applications should take their cue from that existing information.)

I think many others would be interested in this too fellas.

Last edited by Jimmy1; 23-07-2010 at 09:11 PM.

  #26  
Old 23-07-2010, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy1 View Post
I would love a post from Rafe or Steve or Ewan on how Symbian 3 and the N8 functions day to day as a communications device, along with PIM functions.

Specifically, Facebook and Twitter intergration into contacts.

Nokia Messaging: did it get any better?

Are we finally going to get a native Foursquare app or maybe bundle it into Ovi Maps?

How about notifications in Symbian 3?

Destinations? Am I going to still keep on getting annoying pop ups in every single seperate application on how want to connect to the internet, 3G or Wifi, or which connection (I expect to need to do this ONCE when I first set up the phone and that's it. All applications should take their cue from that existing information.)

I think many others would be interested in this too fellas.
Yes please! Things mentioned here make or break the ux and make it meet or miss current day needs. Show us how these are handled on N8.

  #27  
Old 24-07-2010, 05:11 AM
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While everyone here waiting anxiously for the N8, do we know exactly it will be released? It seems years since we know and talk about the development of N8.

  #28  
Old 24-07-2010, 07:47 AM
talhamid talhamid is offline
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@Hardeep: Yes, I agree both are not perfect. At the same time, one two-year-old OS is considerably further on the path of perfection than another 12-year-old with pedigree.

your problems with Milestone seem more hardware related than any fault of Android (I think that's what you are saying as well). My point is that I have found every s60v5 device just as buggy, if not more.

I think Android is inherently more open than (open-source) Symbian ever was, and no, it is not a device specific thing. I am not aware of many ROMs available for Symbian devices. I am no programmer, just a user so I accept that I may not get many terms right.

Besides, what going open source ever did for Symbian? Did we see better flavours of the OS? Did we see any revolutionary apps? On the contrary, there has been very little, if any, innovation.

The contact card thing is just one instance. You are ignoring (1) very easy hacking on most ANdroids (2) Ability to install ROMS relatively easily (3) Facility for COMPLETE backups and restore available both at system level (Nandroid) and at UX level (many programs) (4) Seamless sync with Google services (5) Overall faster operation (5) Instant switch from portrait to landscape (6) Ability to place bookmarks, web addresses, contacts, folders, as well as apps, as shortcuts on homescreen (7) ability to reprogram hardware keys very easily (8) Ability to install and use multiple homescreen programs (9) Many programs enable you to directly play with and use motion sensors as well as make things happen when you touch the edges of the screen (10) Must faster acting motion sensor for games.....

Yes I know you'd say most of it is available with Symbian as well, but it is not as easy, and not as elegant. Whether it is hardware's fault or software, I don't know and don't care. I just can't throw money away in mere HOPES of someday someone getting things right. ANdroid sets (and Iphones) are a million times better working out of the box than anything SYmbian ever graced. This is 2010 and users demand their cake and permission to eat it too.

Let me revert to that homescreen thing: if Nokia, and SYmbian foundation, with hundreds of talented and experienced programmers working day and night, could only come up with S60 v5 after all those years, and Symbian ^3 after a FURTHER two years, is it right for anyone to expect a bright future for Symbian?

Last edited by talhamid; 24-07-2010 at 07:50 AM.

  #29  
Old 25-07-2010, 10:42 AM
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I'm not saying they're hardware related. Just that device firmware is a case-by-case thing.

You're in fact wrong about there being 'no ROMs' for Symbian devices. The Hyper-X firmware for the Samsung i8910 is widely available and used by a number of people including folks from this website. It really is a device specific thing. Nokia like to keep their devices locked down, for whatever business reasons they have.

Symbian has only been entirely open-source for a few months (since February), so it's not like the effects are going to be seen straight away. The first device released based on an open-source version of Symbian is yet to appear (the N8), so let's reserve judgement until then shall we?

And lastly, about the homescreen thing. You really think it's not a debatable point that this:

http://news.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/10381/631389.jpg

looks a lot better than this:

http://media.tested.com/uploads/0/5/...reen_super.png

?

  #30  
Old 26-07-2010, 10:26 AM
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Crown pleasing

Well, the N8 pretty much looks like a pleaser to me already. It even beats the living crap out of the HTC Android's by a wide margin in performance:

http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.j...HTC%20Evo%204G
 

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