Topic Review (Newest First)
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| 29-06-2009 03:00 PM |
| bhvm |
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered
With the stupid keyboard on the N82, the dual LED flash on the N85 and N79, and the presence of Xenon on the 6620 Classic but lack of various other things on it, Nokia is determined not to let us have the perfect phone. Why? Because one handset would triumph over the rest and kill the diversity of their range of phones. But don't ever believe it's due to technical, economic, or battery reasons, because it's not. If they wanted to make the perfect phone, they could easily.
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Bro,
Your Comment gets 10/10 from me!
Nokia is very commercial about their products and all they want is make money!!
Now they launched the N86 8 MP, sans Xenon Flash and any HD video recording capablity!
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| 17-06-2009 12:01 AM |
| Unregistered |
All I'm seeing when I search for this type of comparison is different PHONES being compared.
If I'd have wanted an opinion on different PHONES then I would read about that.
I want some EVIDENCE of XENON versus LED.
This article starts out, pointing out the various different points on LED versus XENON:
LED plus/neg:
+ Batt Life
+ Less hardware
+ Potentially longer lasting / more durable
+ Constant video capture
+ Price
- Brightness
- Longer light burst
XENON
+ Brighter (40x brighter at least)
+ Shorter light burst
- all the things positive above for LED.
Then we get pictures taken with different phones, different cameras, different settings, different firmware..
.. A little news for you guys, but photo's taken with all those things different with the SAME frikken flash will look different!
Why not have a controlled environment, a very high quality speed camera, and the two flashes and actually take the pics? .. Then we have a comparison of the FLASH?
... Sound too straight forward?
How about opening up some hardware, taking the output for the flash (might have to be a slightly older phone), and hooking them up to a derelict Xenon / dual-LED flash?
That way, you KNOW that you can say "look, this motion blurring is because of the ..." - and this is laughable - "... flash and NOT because the camera has an extended exposure time on the sensors!".
You put Xenon flash on the LED phones and they will still produce blur.
You put LED on the Xenon phones, and they will NOT produce blur.
.. BUT, of course you will end up with brighter (maybe white) pictures on the LED phones, while slightly darker images on the Xenon phones.
And will this endless posting of pointless "let's compare this phone to this other phone and say that photo differences are just because of the flash" laughable rubbish ever end?
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| 21-05-2009 01:03 PM |
| Unregistered |
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered
With the stupid keyboard on the N82, the dual LED flash on the N85 and N79, and the presence of Xenon on the 6620 Classic but lack of various other things on it, Nokia is determined not to let us have the perfect phone. Why? Because one handset would triumph over the rest and kill the diversity of their range of phones. But don't ever believe it's due to technical, economic, or battery reasons, because it's not. If they wanted to make the perfect phone, they could easily.
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ya, you are perfectly right, Nokia can make a perfect phone but.................
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| 01-02-2009 10:08 PM |
| MAzor |
Xenon flash in N82
I have taken alot of shots with the N82 with the xenon flash, and I have been really impressed at the flash metering. Even when capturing close up subjects using the macro mode, the flash gets exactly the right amount of power for the shot, with no over exposing what so ever, So the mention of spoiled closeups is incorrect.
The reason that the N82 can get the xenon flash powered exactly right, is due to its preflash metering system. What happens when you take an image with the xenon flash on, is the N82 sends a pre flash out which the camera optic meters how the flash is affecting the scene. If it is over exposing, it send a lower powered flash according to the measured light value so when the image is captured in the image, the second flash essentially gets the correct power and exposure for a well exposed image. The same goes if the preflash results in low exposure, the flash will then increase power accordingly to get a better exposed image.
That is why, why when one take images with the xenon flash, people have noticed the flash fires twice, even though Red eye reduction is turned off.
The circumstance where you will get spoiled closeups is actually with the LED flash. In this case there is no premetering, and the LED flash acts like a dummy non intelligent light, that just fires when told to do so, be it on auto, or forced to fire.
MAzor
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| 13-11-2008 03:32 PM |
| Unregistered |
Additional flash
What about integrating a much more powerful xenon flash into optional "photographer" back cover of the phone -- with separate battery to power the flash?
That way, you can carry thin and light phone to work, and in the evening you simply change the cover and have a powerful flash that doesn't drain the main battery.
I see possibilities here...
Greetings to all, nice discussion
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| 10-10-2008 08:31 PM |
| Unregistered |
Colour Balance
No matter how *bright* LED technology gets it will not be as good as Xenon.
"White" LEDs are at heart a blue LED wrapped in phosphor. The mix of phosphors fills in some of the other colours in the spectrum to get close to a white, but there are lots of gaps. This is why most LED lit pictures are blue biased, especially if they are mixed with natural or incandescent light.
On the other hand Xenon flash tubes are much broader spectrum and roughly the same mix as natural light.
If you want your images flash lit then you need a Xenon flash.
(It's a shame that Nokia dropped the pop-port because they and SonyE used to do little clip on Xenon flash units)
--Charles
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| 21-09-2008 11:21 PM |
| Menneisyys |
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered
The white balance in the dual led nokia n79 picture is incorrect. If you correct the blue and green levels the picture gets the same colour hue as the nokia n82 and that picture is much sharper than that of the nokia n82 and only a little darker.
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... and much more noisier...
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| 21-09-2008 11:11 PM |
| Menneisyys |
My remarks are as follows (sorry for chiming in this late; in general, I browse the Web, in my free time, on my Blackberry 8800 or my HP TC1100 tablet PC; neither of the two are excellent for entering large(r) amounts of text. Therefore, I decided to wait until going back to my full-sized Thinkpad.)
1. The "Cons" list should have consisted of one of the most important points: the size of the capacitor needed to drive the Xenon flash. It’s this that is prohibitive for most camera phone manufacturers, not the other factors you’ve mentioned.
Currently, capacitors used in contemporary cameras are about third the length (and the same thickness) of an AAA battery. Dunno if they can be made even smaller; I don’t think so. (Nevertheless, they’re already pretty small. I love collecting old technology; for example, a Soviet external flash unit manufactured in the eighties, driven by 4 A (the largest) batteries, had IIRC two A-sized capacitors and still, even with being backed with really strong “A” batteries being able to sustain a very high Amperage, had a recharging time of about 30-40 seconds. See how technology advances? Current flashes are orders of magnitude better.) While in a dedicated digicam this isn’t that much of a concern, in a phone it may be.
Let me for example point out that the early 2003 Sony Palm OS model NZ90 (see http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1202 ) had (compared to all the other models of the same form factor) so thick a hinge because it also had to contain a capacitor. (And, as a side note, it was a pretty bad-designed and engineered flash: you got a “low battery” warning after using the flash two or three times with a fully charged battery.)
2. What I’d recommend to Nokia (or, for that matter, any other company releasing quality phones) is releasing a separate, additional add-on for their future high-end models containing both the flash and the capacitor. The handsets themselves should contain, preferably, a two-LED flashes not taking up much estate and having the advantages of the LED (for example, constant illumination in video mode if permitted; close-ups; helping autofocus in darkness etc.). The add-ons would add Xenon flash on top of this and should look like and be operated the same way as the external camera module for the Sony-Ericsson t68(i).
Your thoughts folks?
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| 21-09-2008 10:18 PM |
| Unregistered |
dual led white balance
The white balance in the dual led nokia n79 picture is incorrect. If you correct the blue and green levels the picture gets the same colour hue as the nokia n82 and that picture is much sharper than that of the nokia n82 and only a little darker.
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| 20-09-2008 12:18 PM |
| ashu |
dual led
dual led is not ideal for perfect pics. Nokia has tried to have the dual led phones positioned as video phones with the capability to take very decent photographs.
However, xenon is clear cut. I know by having xenon, my video capabilities will be compromised but i will take the best possible photographs.
For me the second scenario makes sense, i will have pics in night, and pics and videos in days till the time some upgrade comes for xenon lovers.
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| 20-09-2008 06:01 AM |
| pachi |
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4everskyline
xenon is very cool!
but the worst thing on N82 is the flash is useless while capturing video...
why don't nokia makes N82 like the sony ericsson K850? K850 has both xenon and LED flash,it do better.
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Nokia needs to wake the hell up. They are making too many models aka SE.
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| 19-09-2008 02:11 PM |
| Unregistered |
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4everskyline
xenon is very cool!
but the worst thing on N82 is the flash is useless while capturing video...
why don't nokia makes N82 like the sony ericsson K850? K850 has both xenon and LED flash,it do better.
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Good call! add an optical zoom & raw capturing and that could be the new nokia camera / video phone!!
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| 19-09-2008 10:57 AM |
| 4everskyline |
xenon is very cool!
but the worst thing on N82 is the flash is useless while capturing video...
why don't nokia makes N82 like the sony ericsson K850? K850 has both xenon and LED flash,it do better.
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| 19-09-2008 08:02 AM |
| malerocks |
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered
I wonder if anyone thinks that the single LED managed to capture a nice atmosphere for the drum set, as I think drum sets are often associated with low light and stuff like that. I mean, I think I wouldn't want a shot from a disco to look like I have taken it in a brightly lit psychiatric hospital... though they probably resemble each other in a way.....
Two cents.
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Your 2 cents accepted buddy. And your comment again highlights what we keep saying in these posts - each individual's needs are different and what satisfys me may not satisfy you...
Which brings me to my own demand - how about a dual LED flash with the option to choose single or dual LED before the snap? That way I can choose the amount of light I want for a snap.
I agree that a good light is essential in most of photos, but trust me there are some photos which are brilliant in low light conditions too. I know, I have taken them.
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| 19-09-2008 07:03 AM |
| Unregistered |
Atmosphere
I wonder if anyone thinks that the single LED managed to capture a nice atmosphere for the drum set, as I think drum sets are often associated with low light and stuff like that. I mean, I think I wouldn't want a shot from a disco to look like I have taken it in a brightly lit psychiatric hospital... though they probably resemble each other in a way.....
Two cents.
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