View Full Version : 6260 MP3 format & SD


irontech
12-01-2005, 08:27 AM
1) What other format of MP3 does 6260 (Symbian 7.0) support?

I tried 32kbps 44100 , 64kbps 22050, both mono & stereo but the sound quality is bad, like jagged.

Finally, I convert to 128kbps 44100 stereo then the sound quality is good.

2) I bought & tried Trescend 256MB (RSMMC), it works fine with my 6260. (will get 1GB for it)

But, it seem failed by using Nokia 6260 format. (It takes more than 30 minutes also can't finished)

I only can use XP card reader format it, cluster size is 4096.

How can I format it with 512 cluster? (Like default standard Nokia 32MB SD) :con?

DaViD_BRaNDoN
13-01-2005, 09:48 AM
try this in command line "format x: /FS:FAT /A:512"

Thanh-BKK
21-01-2005, 04:15 PM
Hello :)

I don't know about the cluster size thing, buyt what difference does it make? I run both the 6260 of my boyfriend as well as mine own 3650 with MMC's that were formatted in the MMC reader under XP, with standard FAT file system. I don't even know what size the clusters are.

What difference does it make to have smaller clusters?

Kind regards.....

Thanh

dansansome
21-01-2005, 04:22 PM
i think its something to do with if a bit of software (or whatever) uses (eg) 20% of a cluster, then the remaining 80% of the cluster cannot be used for something else, and therefore makes available space reduce.

say you have a 32MB cluster size (being VERY extreme here) on an empty 32MB mmc. you put a 1 MB file on the card. you "know" that you have 31MB left, but the cluster has been used, so the mmc wont let any more data be written.

the smaller the cluster size, the less wasted space in the memory.

i think thats how it works anyhow... :)

Thanh-BKK
21-01-2005, 04:45 PM
Thank you very much for that :) I never cared for that so far...... so that means that my clusters are 4 kilobyes, and when a file puts there some few bytes in, the rest of still almost 4 kb is wasted?

But on the other side, if the clusters are smaller, then there are more of them, right? I know of FAT that it loves to fragment, so i guess that smaller clusters make it easier to become fragmented, and, in the end... corrupted?

Well i just wait till my next full backup (anyway tomorrow) then i'll try that command line thing and just format it once again. I got a 512 MB so the few lost kilobytes aren't really important (i store mainly large files such as mp3's and avi's).

Kind regards.......

Thanh

irontech
22-01-2005, 01:41 PM
FAT 16 seem cluster size is a "fix", nothing much we can reduce but enlarge it. Unfortunately symbian doesn't support FAT32.....

I've tried using XP or my PDA format, still 4096. What if I get 1GB mmc.....20-30% space will be waste.... :(

Thanh-BKK
22-01-2005, 02:13 PM
Hello :)

Well i tried to find out what cluster size mine is formatted in - no idea, when i go via "properties" i can view many things, but nothing like "cluster size". However i checked the MMC for fragmentation and found it had 0 (zero!) percent fragmentation and only two files had each two fragments. I think that isn't too bad considered that i constantly take pictures and delete them from the MMC after uploading to the PC, also i constantly install and uninstall applications via MMC.

Can actually, should it fragment sooner or later, the XP defragmenter be used..?

Irontech, i got a solution for you.

Since the 6260 has seemingly problems formatting non-original MMC's (and therefor my MMC reader can NOT read the original 6260 MMC, yet ANY other!) why don't you just pop it into the phone of a friend who has a Symbian? Any with MMC support will do. First backup your MMC on the PC (attention! Very important is that you are able to see and copy system files! In any open folder window, go to Tools -> Folder Options -> View and in the table under "advanced settings" uncheck "do not show hidden files and folders" and "Hide protected operating system files"). Then open the MMC folder, select all files (you will see several previously invisible folders and files) and copy those all to a new folder on your desktop or wherever. Then format the MMC on the reader to get rid of your files, otherwise the phone you are going to put it into might crash. Then put the "virgin" MMC in another phone, like 7610 (has RS-MMC as well) or use that little adaptor thingy that should have come with your MMC and put it in a 3650 or 6600. Format it there to get your 512 byte clusters. Then put it in your reader again, delete the new files which are there from the other phone, and reverse the backup procedure, i.e. open your new folder with the MMC backup files, again select all of them and copy them onto the newly formatted MMC. Voila: 512 byte clusters and all content still there :)

I think you DO know someone with another Symbian, right? :)

Kind regards.....

your Thanh

nokya
28-01-2005, 09:39 AM
just tried the command line on a 512 rsmmc and i get the message 'the specified cluster size is too small for fat 16/12'

but ive been able to format it through the 6260 without a problem, how can i check if its been done with 512 cluster size?

Thanh-BKK
28-01-2005, 01:21 PM
Hi there :)

Since i just had my phone flashed, i also needed to reformat my MMC. So i did the test. I checked how many bytes are available/used/free on the MMC, then formatted it with the phone, and put all the files via backup on it again.

NO DIFFERENCE, not a single byte!

I tought, since there are quite a large number of VERY small files (few bytes) from installed apps, there should be some difference between using 4k and 512byte clusters. So either the phone does NOT provide 512byte clusters, or the computer DOES TOO.

I have no way of seing the cluster size anywhere. How to do that..? I'm now interested in that matter :)

Kind regards......

Thanh

DaViD_BRaNDoN
28-01-2005, 01:22 PM
just tried the command line on a 512 rsmmc and i get the message 'the specified cluster size is too small for fat 16/12'

but ive been able to format it through the 6260 without a problem, how can i check if its been done with 512 cluster size?

Pop you memory card into a memory card reader and try "chkdsk X:" in command line. Replace "X" with your specific drive letter.

Thanh-BKK
28-01-2005, 01:51 PM
Hi there :)

Is that "allocation units"? It won't mention "cluster". But in each allocation unit i have 8,192 bytes. Does tyhat mean i have 8kb clusters..?????

That was formatted by the phone! (a 3650). Just tested another MMC (that one from my boyfriend), it has 4.096 bytes per allocation unit (Nokia 6260).

Do i need to do anything about those large allocation units - CAN i do anything about them?

Kind regards.....

Thanh

Thanh-BKK
28-01-2005, 02:05 PM
Hi again :)

Yup i found the answer via Google.

Volume Size FAT16 Cluster Size FAT32 Cluster Size NTFS Cluster Size
7MB 16MB 2KB Not supported 512 bytes
17MB 32MB 512 bytes Not supported 512 bytes
33MB 64MB 1KB 512 bytes 512 bytes
65MB 128MB 2KB 1KB 512 bytes
129MB 256MB 4KB 2KB 512 bytes
257MB 512MB 8KB 4KB 512 bytes
513MB 1GB 16KB 4KB 1KB
1GB 2GB 32KB 4KB 2KB
2GB 4GB 64KB 4KB 4KB
4GB 8GB Not supported 4KB 4KB
8GB 16GB Not supported 8KB 4KB
16GB 32GB Not supported 16KB 4KB
32GB 2TB Not supported Not supported 4KB

Hope there will be an app that allows NTFS on those MMC's soon :)

regards.....

Thanh

nokya
28-01-2005, 05:48 PM
yup i have 8192 bytes per allocation unit, and this was formatted on a 6260, can i get it down to 4kb per unit?

Thanh-BKK
29-01-2005, 03:22 PM
Hi Nokya :)

As you can see in the table i posted (i had that from a website, found via Google) the cluster size depends on the size of the volume (i.e. the bigger space on the card, the larger the clusters). If your MMC is 257-512 MB size (like mine), you have to live with 8kb clusters.

Mine is 512 MB and i have (also formatted by the phone!) 8kb units. My boyfriend has a 256 MB MMC and it's got (and rightly so, according to that table) 4kb units.

It seems that the reson for this is the size of the FAT itself. If larger memory + smaller clusters, the FAT itself would be too large (thus wasting memory space AND easier to fragment/corrupt!). Remember win98 and it's crashy behaviour due to using FAT? I am glad not having to use THAT anymore, thanks to XP's NTFS (used that with w2k already).

Kind regards.....

your Thanh

nokya
29-01-2005, 04:30 PM
hmm thanks for that, ive got a 512 and i probably wont need a bigger card for now so wasted space isnt an issue but the cluster issue will probably be more relevent to 1gb users as it seems a lot of space will be wasted.